Andy Smith 00:00 
A quick disclaimer before we begin, the PEMF podcast does not contain any medical advice, and the content provided is for informational purposes only. If you have any health concerns, please visit a healthcare professional.

Andy Smith 00:19 
Welcome back to another episode of the PEMF podcast, and today I'm joined by Luke Campbell, which I'm extremely excited about. Welcome to the podcast, Luke.

Luke Campbell MBE 00:26 
Thank you for having me.

Andy Smith 00:28 
Pleasure to be here. Yeah. And I'll go through some of your accolades, but you're going to have to help me because there's quite a few of them. So former professional boxer and Olympic gold medalist, MBE, and now mayor of Hull.

Luke Campbell MBE 00:44 
Hull and East Yorkshire.

Andy Smith 00:45 
Kept missing that one at the end, and father of three boys.

Luke Campbell MBE 00:49 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 00:49 
So, you know, big accolades in there.

Luke Campbell MBE 00:51 
There is, there is. So I was an amateur, I'm the most successful amateur in Great Britain history, which is pretty cool.

Andy Smith 00:59 
So what does that mean? That means before you turned pro, you had done all these different things.

Luke Campbell MBE 01:06 
Like even to this day, in the amateur world, all the greats that have come through, I'm still the most successful amateur in Great Britain history in the winning medals, Olympic gold medal, world silver medal, which could have been a gold medal, just went the other way by two points. European gold medalist, first person to win one of them in 47 years in England. So having that puts me at the top. I'm sure someone will come in and beat it soon, but until then, it's me.

Andy Smith 01:44 
No, good. And, you know, you started quite an early age. Let me know if any of this is wrong, but 13, I think you started boxing.

Luke Campbell MBE 01:52 
That's right, yep.

Andy Smith 01:53 
And, you know, you're, I want to talk about kind of your mindset and, and because you, you do your first two fights, lose both, you go on to do another nine fights, and I believe only three of those you won. So a lot of people at that stage would be like, maybe boxing is not for me, you know, but what made you keep going? And what made you keep this as a career choice?

Luke Campbell MBE 02:20 
I constantly wanted to be better today than I was yesterday and that's what motivated me. I lost my first two fights, I lost my first one on points, I lost my second one, I got stopped in my second one. Then I won two and then I think I lost like five in a row.

Andy Smith 02:41 
Did you doubt your ability from.

Luke Campbell MBE 02:43 
Then I won one. I used to come home all the time crying every time I'd lost a fight to my mum and dad and my mum was like well but what didn't you do? I kept getting hit with the right hand so let's just practice not getting hit with the right hand then and then I go away and practice not getting hit with right hand or I'd come home and I'd get beat and I was crying I says I just I feel like I won't fit enough so she's like well let's work on your fitness then because I question myself for many many time and many many years and then when I was stood on the Olympic podium with a gold medal around my neck you know I looked I looked on my left and there was there was two people there from Japan and Ireland getting no sorry Japan and Cuba getting a bronze medal and then the guy on my right was John John Evan from Ireland who was getting a silver medal and I thought why why me at that point and then I looked back through my career all the losses you know all the hard times I had it was all for that one moment but every one of them was a learning lesson a learning curve and it was my mum and dad that kept giving me little things just to go back and work on that and get better at that um but yeah I just wanted to be better than I was yesterday

Andy Smith 03:56 
Do you think you manifested that gold medal? So, you know, did although you had a lot of doubt in your ability, you know, did you think you were going to be up there at some point?

Luke Campbell MBE 04:05 
I used to daydream, I used to dream about me stood on the Olympic podium with that gold medal around my neck, crying like in tears. It used to make me cry when I used to think about it. For many, many years before it, I used to think of that one moment and I used to get upset in that moment, it used to make me cry because I was that passionate about it.

Andy Smith 04:32 
Yeah. So, you know, and when was it that you started winning more than you were losing? You know, how long did it take before you got to that stage where you started really believing in yourself?

Luke Campbell MBE 04:41 
Well, it, it was only, I mean, it was many, many years later where I thought, Oh, actually I could do something here, but I, after two years of boxing, I got off to a terrible start. Um, but then I got to, um, a national championships and I got picked to be final. And then I got picked to represent got gone an England training camp and he had to announce 15. So two years late, only took me two years to get on, on an England camp, but I went through so much in them first two years. Um, I won my first ever tournament for, uh, in a four nations for England. And then they picked me then to go onto the junior Olympics tournament, which was in Louisiana. Um, and I went there I think in 2003 and I got a bronze medal there. So very rough start. Um, but then I was boxing for England by the time I was 15 and then by the time I was 27, I won the gold medal in, in London, but there was a time in my career. Um, just after 2010, 2000, 2009, 2010, where I was going to quit boxing all completely altogether. Some new coaches has come in to the training camps. I wasn't, I wasn't getting on with them. They wasn't getting on with me. Um, wasn't a very good relationship and I was just so homesick. I just didn't want to be away from home. I was homesick. I wasn't performing. I damaged my knuckle in a training camp in Kazakhstan and I just didn't want to be there. And, you know, I was sat down on the bench cause I had an operation on my end for 11 months. And yeah, I was, I was contemplating completely quitting boxing altogether. But my family around me, both friends said, you know, you've got a couple of years to go before the Olympics. They'll quit now and then wonder later in life, what if just give it everything in these next two years and then see where you went. So I literally reached rock bottom in boxing, but I had to reach rock bottom to get me to the top. And in that two years, I turned everything around again and went, you know, I went from number one in great Britain, right down the rankings. And then from back down the rankings all the way up to number one in the country again. And then after the world championships, I was number two in the world and then obviously winning the Olympics. I was number one in the world.

Andy Smith 07:25 
So nearly ended before it all began. So before we get to the Olympics, talk about that and your kind of lead up to that and your recovery and all those sorts of things. I'm going to do a couple of quick fire questions for you.

Luke Campbell MBE 07:36 
Okay

Andy Smith 07:36 
So just short snappy answers and then we'll kind of take a bit of a deeper dive later on. So what my mini career still means to most of you personally?

Luke Campbell MBE 07:46 
I think winning the Olympic gold, I think it was something when I was a very young boxer when I was useless. My dad used to tell me I was going to be an Olympic champion and I used to argue back with him saying, oh, shut up, you're wrong. Dad, I'm 10 fights in and I've won three and he's telling me I'm going to be an Olympic champion and I'm arguing with him. So winning that definitely is my greatest achievement in boxing.

Andy Smith 08:14 
I mean, winning an Olympic gold medal is pretty up there.

Luke Campbell MBE 08:18 
Yeah, it's cool.

Andy Smith 08:19 
What do you wish you understood more about recovery earlier?

Luke Campbell MBE 08:22 
I wish we're driving our bodies to the limits every day, but when I was young and in training camps, recovery was here and all that really. Now, I wish if I had that recovery side to it, how much further, how much better could I have been in my performances?

Andy Smith 08:45 
And what part of recovery do you think people tend to overlook the most?

Luke Campbell MBE 08:49 
Looking after the body, you know, they've got one body injuries is can happen just click your fingers. I think it's so important to be looking after your body for injuries, but also making sure that your body is constantly in optimal shape as much as possible. If you're pushing it as far as you can every day.

Andy Smith 09:10 
What does good recovery look like for you now?

Luke Campbell MBE 09:13 
For now, good recovery is red light, it's CELLER8, it's using the mat, it's P-P-M-F.

Andy Smith 09:21 
P-E-M-F?

Luke Campbell MBE 09:22 
P-E-M-F, sorry. I always get the... I always drop the e...

Andy Smith 09:25 
Everyone does.

Luke Campbell MBE 09:26 
It's a bit of a mouthful.

Andy Smith 09:27 
PEMF, PEMF is an easy way to say it.

Luke Campbell MBE 09:29 
Yeah, I'd say that and the sauna for me is my perfect recovery.

Andy Smith 09:33 
Yeah, it's a good stack and some good biohacking tools there. A couple of either-or's, PEMF or Red Light?

Luke Campbell MBE 09:40 
Together, together, yeah.

Andy Smith 09:43 
Great answer, Ice bath or sauna?

Luke Campbell MBE 09:46 
I enjoy saunas much more than an ice bath, but the saunas have got the benefit for really helping detox your body where I feel like for recovery I feel like the ice bath then I don't know, I feel great after getting out of a sauna and an hour after using an ice bath I feel great as well. So I think if you can use them both, sauna, ice bath, sauna, you know, get them both in.

Andy Smith 10:17 
And this will make sense for our listeners later on in the episode, but one thing you would change about the NHS?

Luke Campbell MBE 10:22 
I think there's a misinterpretation of the NHS is not there to fix anyone's health. The NHS, for me, the hospital, it's there to fix a broken leg. It's there to stitch a cut up. It's there to, if you've got your appendix that are swelling up and you need that to be taken out, it's there for that. That's what I look at the NHS for. It's more to fix it, but I would never rely on it to fix my health.

Andy Smith 10:54 
And the biggest goal as mayor?

Luke Campbell MBE 10:56 
The biggest goal as mayor is delivering for all the residents in Hull and East Yorkshire and making sure that we're here. I'm here to try and benefit everyone in this region and making positive changes because we've got a beautiful region and we've got so much untapped potential. It's my job now just to start digging into that untapped potential and unlocking it. So that's the job I need to do.

Andy Smith 11:30 
Yeah, big job, big job at hand. Big job.

Luke Campbell MBE 11:33 
Big job.

Andy Smith 11:33 
Okay. So let's talk about your, you know, your Olympic lead up. Um, I've listened to a couple of podcasts before and you say it's not like you, you get the call one day, you know, it's, it's, there's, there's a different route in different way about it, but you're obviously within the Olympic team. And what does back then, what does recovery look like? And what does, are you encouraged to do certain things, use certain equipment, change a diet, you know, is, is there rules? Is there regulations? Like, you know, we always hear about, we can see you fighting. We can see the highlights. We can go to the Olympic goal, but we can't see the lead up to that, you know? And that's, that's where a lot of Olympians or professional, you know, professional athletes, they don't see the work that goes into this. So, you know, what does that look like back then, especially for an Olympic

Luke Campbell MBE 12:28 
I think in the team, it's obviously it's all, everything's on the individual. So we had access to a physio all the time. So, you know, be finishing a training session, going in to see the physio, getting stretched, you know, getting a little deep tissue massage, triggering some points in your shoulders if you tie it or whatever there. So that was part of recovery, but it was all on us. We had to go in there and book the physio if we wanted to use it. But then we also had access to an ice bath downstairs and a little jacuzzi and sauna area. And it's funny looking back, the only thing I ever used was the ice bath.

Andy Smith 13:10 
Hm.

Luke Campbell MBE 13:11 
But yeah, there was a sauna in there. There was a steam room and there was a little jacuzzi, but I just use the sauna. And maybe the jacuzzi, the ice bath and the jacuzzi.

Andy Smith 13:21 
Was there education around it?

Luke Campbell MBE 13:23 
No, not really. There wasn't really. But that was on the individual today. So not all. There was only a handful of boxes that would go and start filling the ice bath up and getting and use it. A lot of the others would never go in the ice bath.

Andy Smith 13:36 
Yeah

Luke Campbell MBE 13:36 
Because they just didn't like it. Or, you know, they just couldn't be asked to do it, basically.

Andy Smith 13:41 
And that's key, really, because, you know, especially the education around these things, you know, ice baths are great, but we're starting to learn that it's more about the mental resilience that comes from ice baths rather than the muscle recovery. And actually, using an ice bath at the wrong point or the wrong time can actually be, you know, counterproductive against muscle growth and things like that. So, you know, it's interesting to know about how...

Luke Campbell MBE 14:04 
Se we was taught none of that. We was taught absolutely nothing around that. It was just like, there's an ice bath, good for recovery, use it when you want. But then you later laying down the line is that ice baths was good for recovery near to the end of a training camp because of, you know, you don't want it to, because it gets in the way of you then growing that muscle and making it stronger and adapting it. But I was always making weight. So there's times in where they're, well, I actually, I'm not, I don't want to grow muscle or get bigger or anything like that, because I've got to met the weight anyhow. But there was times and places best when to use it. We weren't given any information like that. It was just like, there's a recovery area, use it if you want. And I think about, I think in the past recovery, became a bit of a chore to a lot of people. Like it's just something else more to do. And I'm tired from training. I can't be bothered. So it's about making recovery as easy and as relaxing as possible.

Andy Smith 15:12 
No, for sure. And, you know, the other thing is injury prevention, you know, was you taught about injury prevention or anything to do with like, you know, because, or would it be just be jumped on, you know, once you've torn a ligament, this is what you're going to do, you know, it's, it's kind of

Luke Campbell MBE 15:29 
Nothing really, apart from, you know, just making, make sure you're warm up properly and you stretch at the end. That was literally it.

Andy Smith 15:35 
Yeah

Luke Campbell MBE 15:36 
You know, I always used to see a lot of kids in camp with plasters and stickers all over the body because of constantly carrying injuries. I was, I think I was very lucky as an athlete. I only split a tendon in my knuckle on a training camp. Other than that, I was, I was, I was all right. I didn't really suffer from any injuries other than that little niggles here and there as you do, you know, your back's aching. So, you know, um, but other than that, I was, I was fairly lucky with injury.

Andy Smith 16:09 
What about diet? Do they, you know, do they control your diet? Sometimes you hear that top pro athletes, you know, they, they, they can't go out and just buy whatever food they want. Or again, was that quite relaxed back then?

Luke Campbell MBE 16:20 
So on GB camps, it was we had our food provided for us, you know, breakfast, dinner, lunch and dinner, but boxers could eat anything they want in between that. But it was down to the individual again, whether you had the discipline to be strict on your diet. But we had healthy food for lunch and dinner. But like I said, then we might all go to cinema on a Wednesday night, just to split the week up and, you know, we're eating fudge and sweets and whatever else, watching the cinema or deciding just to not eat anything or still drink your bottle of water.

Andy Smith 17:03 
Yeah, yeah. And what about sleep? Like, you know, because we know now that sleep is probably the easiest free biohack that out there, you know, if you can get sleep right, then, you know, you can recharge your body and, you know, you're, and even for the training, you know, you're going to be way more switched on and fighting better and sparring better if you've had a good night's sleep. But again, do you get educated on this sort of thing? You know, is it, is the information given to you or is it all down to the athletes to kind of learn that all themselves?

Luke Campbell MBE 17:37 
Yeah, I think it's certainly down to the athletes. That's why I shared a room with Anthony Ogogo because me and him was always in bed early. I mean, Doug, I was always shattered anyhow. Like, I've just trained four times today. Like, I'm falling asleep at 10 o'clock. You know, I was up at seven out on the track running, but there was a lot of other kids in there that I didn't want a room with because they're up till 11, 12, one in the morning, messing around and I just thought, I need my sleep. But again, it's not, when you're younger, you know, and the coaches are saying, get a good night's sleep. It's just like, yeah, yeah, whatever. You know, you don't really take it in properly and you don't realize how useful a good night's sleep is for you. But I went to sleep early and ill. So I was, and that's why I shared with Ogogo because he was like me, you know, quite disciplined. Didn't want to stay up all night, liked his sleep. So me and him would just share always training camps on when we're away in tournaments. Me and him would share room. I think.

Andy Smith 18:50 
I've done boxing for a number of years, obviously not to the same level, but I had a charity fight and I had like eight weeks of training for it. I think the focus in either the athlete's head is if I'm not training, my opponent is. The focus really tends to be on full tilt training. Every hour of the day you can, if you're not training, then you're giving them the advantage. But it just doesn't seem to be any kind of real focus or time that people put into the downtime. You need to take a couple of days off or you need to recover. If you're not going to allow that, you're not going to allow your body to recover that way. So coming back to the Olympics, your story of getting through there, I actually watched your fight. It was incredible. I remember back in the day watching the Olympics, trying to get into some of the different sports. One of the ones, being a keen boxer myself, was the boxing. So watching your event was incredible, winning. I think you were the first gold medalist in your weight since 1908 or something.

Luke Campbell MBE 20:01 
I think it is actually. Yeah, I think it is.

Andy Smith 20:02 
Yeah. And it wasn't an easy right. Your whole career, you haven't taken the easy path. You had three fights, was it? In the actual tournament? Or was it four?

Luke Campbell MBE 20:14 
I had four fights because I was seeded. I think the top five or the top four were seeded, so we were split up. You don't get the best one and two that's fighting each other in the first fight, so it's broke up and seeded. I was seeded, so I had four fights in the Olympics, but in the World Championships before that, I had six fights.

Andy Smith 20:37 
Yeah that's it and how spread out are they, so that's...

Luke Campbell MBE 20:40 
Well, a prime example, I mean, the Olympics was spread out fine, but to be honest with you, I don't think I fought for the first week in the Olympics. So that was like frustrating because it took me a bit of time to get going. But I didn't have, I missed the first fight because I was seated, but like, uh, in the world championships, I out the six fights, I had one in the first week. And then I had five in the second week. So it wasn't really split well.

Andy Smith 21:08 
Yeah. And you know, recovery time in that again, like you've probably got a day or what was your shortest period between two fights.

Luke Campbell MBE 21:17 
Yeah, a couple of days I think, something like that. That's what it was like in the Olympics. But I remember going down and it was just the ice baths. I wouldn't dare get in a sauna at that time because it's like, oh, I get in a sauna, it makes you weak, which obviously it doesn't if you use it correctly. So it was just literally ice baths. And I'd see all sorts of people in there from all different spots and stuff. And the boxing was really hard to qualify for the Olympics, like really hard. Like I had to be in the last eight in the world championships just to qualify for the Olympics. And then I'm sat talking to some guy who's in fencing and he's number 43. So I went, oh, so you're ranked number 43 in the world. He goes, no, in the UK. I'm like, how are you at the Olympics? How are you at the Olympics if you're number 43 in the world, in the UK and you're in the Olympics in the country. Yeah. So really baffled me.

Andy Smith 22:16 
Yeah. And I mean, you know, that short period you've got between those fights is key, you know, if you had the idea of different ways in which you can, you know, treat the body and, you know, get that ultimate rest in between those fights.

AD 22:30 
Today's episode is brought to you by Monk, the ice bath brand backed by Anthony Joshua. If you're training hard or just living fast, recovery has to match your output. That's why more athletes and high performers are turning to cold exposure. Cold exposure reduces inflammation, improves sleep, boost circulation and trains your nervous system to stay calm under pressure. Monk builds the most beautiful looking ice baths designed for one thing, resilience. They're backed by world-class athletes, coaches, fighters, and founders alike. Through the Monk app, you'll get goal-based guidance, whether you're in muscle building mode, tapering for competition, or pushing endurance. It's recovery dialed into what you're training for. It also syncs to whoop, aura, Garmin, and more. Anthony Joshua backs Monk, and it's easy to see why. It's recovery that feels as disciplined as your training. Get 10% off Monk at discovermonk.com with the code P-E-M-F-P-O-D and feel the difference between rest and recovery.

Andy Smith 23:33 
But, you know, you came out on top. You beat the Irish in the final for the gold medal. And, you know, what's that feeling like? I mean, everyone's probably asked you that, probably difficult to explain, but, you know, I've watched the highlights last night to remind me, and, you know, you broke down the minute it was...

Luke Campbell MBE 23:53 
It felt like dayshavoo because I was dreaming of that moment many many years before it and it always used to get me upset in that moment. I used to cry in that moment just thinking about it and then I was in that moment so I had to cry. But yeah it was surreal, it really was. That was the only thing that was like my dreams and goals was to become Olympic champion. I was going to retire from boxing after that. I never thought to go on to be a professional or never had any goals or dreams or ambitions of going on and doing something professional. For some reason it was just always the Olympics.

Andy Smith 24:32 
Yeah. And that was the same year that Anthony Joshua was in the Olympics. Was it 2012 as well?

Luke Campbell MBE 24:39 
Yeah he won it the day after me.

Andy Smith 24:40 
Yeah. Oh, nice. Yes. He became friends with Ante Joshua. And I would say, yeah, it's always a weird link with our podcast guests. And, you know, the sponsor of this episode is Monk Ice bath, who completely out of the blue, you know, sponsored this number of episodes. And Anthony Joshua is an investor of Monk Ice bath.

Luke Campbell MBE 25:00 
Interesting.

Andy Smith 25:00 
It was an accident.

Luke Campbell MBE 25:04 
Yeah, interesting.

Andy Smith 25:05 
But yeah, so, you know, you still talk to Anthony Joshua now?

Luke Campbell MBE 25:09 
Yeah. Joshua's a great guy, I've always had respect for Joshua and I've always liked him. We got on really well during the amateur days and as a professional, we trained together for the first three to four years. So yeah, I've always been a supporter of Joshua. I always messaged him before every fight wishing him good luck and all that type of stuff and sometimes he'll just ring me out the blue and we'll speak on the phone for an hour or something like that but yeah, always kept that relationship there, checking in, see how he is and stuff.

Andy Smith 25:44 
Yeah sure. So you come out of the Olympics, got a gold medal, kind of thrown into a bit of fame, stardom, that sort of thing. Before you turn pro, I believe there was a stint on ice.

Luke Campbell MBE 25:57 
Dancing on ice, yeah.

Andy Smith 25:59 
Yeah. So and and I actually again, you know, I followed quite a lot of your career even you know I think at that time I was living at home. So who's watching dancing on ice with her parents and stuff like that and you got by quite far.

Luke Campbell MBE 26:12 
I got to the final. Yeah.

Andy Smith 26:14 
Yeah so, you know, you

Andy Smith 26:17 
Like Bambi on ice.

Andy Smith 26:17 
Yeah treating it the same, you know and and You know if anything I can imagine you were you were training for that just as you were You know boxing fight. Or is that incorrect?

Luke Campbell MBE 26:28 
Um, I was the last on the ice and the first one off, you know, I didn't, I didn't like the ice. Yeah. It wasn't for me. I mean, I think I only got to the final because everyone from Hull East Yorkshire was voting for me.

Andy Smith 26:44 
Yeah.

Luke Campbell MBE 26:44 
You know, but it was a fantastic experience. It really was. I don't think I'd do it again, but it was a good experience.

Andy Smith 26:52 
Yeah. And that's kind of maybe led to, you know, what, what you're going through at the moment, you know, you know, you've got the public boat and that sort of thing.

Luke Campbell MBE 27:00 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 27:01 
But again, actually, I wanted to kind of ask around, you know, the TV show and things like that. Are they giving you tips of training, recovery and that sort of thing? Or, you know, is it very much about the about the night each time?

Luke Campbell MBE 27:16 
Yeah, it's about the night, it's all about the show. That's it, nothing about recovery or training or anything.

Andy Smith 27:23 
Because they get a lot of injuries in that show as well.

Luke Campbell MBE 27:26 
I popped a bone in my wrist on that show so I did it trying to pick her up above my head which was fine but because my wrists have always been really tight because they've always been locked in one position don't really bend back much and as I lifted her above my head there was a bone that popped in my wrist so I couldn't do lifts for a little bit.

Andy Smith 27:43 
So then there wasn't any kind of structured recovery through that, did you talk to anybody about the pain?

Luke Campbell MBE 27:51 
No nothing it was me just sorting my own physio out.

Andy Smith 27:53 
Yeah.

Luke Campbell MBE 27:54 
That was it.

Andy Smith 27:54 
Fair enough.

Luke Campbell MBE 27:56 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 27:56 
So then how long after that do you then term pro?

Luke Campbell MBE 28:00 
I think it was straight after that show, I turned pro, and I sold out an outdoor stadium, Hull KR. I sold out that stadium in my first fight, which was massive. There's not many people that's done that. And I had Kell Brook on my undercard.

Andy Smith 28:19 
Alright, that's incredible. So that's incredible, yeah, on my debut. Yeah, Kell Brook went on to be a huge reputation in the pro ranks.

Luke Campbell MBE 28:30 
Yeah. Very good. Very good.

Andy Smith 28:31 
So, you know, you start, I assume pro, you start zero, zero, you know, you don't, they don't count any kind of amateur career, it's just, yeah, straight in. And you know, we were talking about your, your professional career before, before the podcast and you didn't take the easiest route, to say the least, you know, you had some formidable opponents, you know, there's a lot of people in, in your career that have maybe taken an easier route and maybe fought for longer and, you know, and, and maybe got some bigger cards at the end. You decided to take them from, you know, from day dot or all the, all the heavy hitters. You know, when was your, when was your first defeat in the pro ranks?

Luke Campbell MBE 29:15 
Yeah, I mean, looking back at my career now, professional, I think that's why so many fans have a lot of respect for me because of the fights that I had and how good I did in them fights. My first loss was against a guy called Mendy, a French guy who was just a relentless guy that's like never been stopped and he's got a great engine and just comes forward non-stop. I took him on three weeks notice and he was already in a full training camp to fight a tall Southpaw. To be honest with you at the time, it was very poor management. I was over-trained. I was sparring amateur boxers on there and counting punches where there was movers. I wasn't sparring anyone that puts pressure on and comes forward. But I was over-trained for that fight and I just should not have been in the ring that night and they give it to him. I still thought I nicked the fight to be fair and so did a lot of people, but because it was close, they wanted to give it to him, which is fine.

Andy Smith 30:22 
Is there a pressure to overtrain, you know, I know you mentioned you said you were over trained for that event Yeah, you know is is there a pressure from the team from you know, where's the pressure coming from to? Constantly training myself or is it?

Luke Campbell MBE 30:35 
I was more or less training myslef.

Andy Smith 30:35 
Yeah, was it self pressure?

Luke Campbell MBE 30:37 
Yeah. I was more or less training myself. You know, I had a coach that maybe seen me once or twice a week, you know, which is not ideal at all. And it just wasn't nothing was nothing was right. Like there was no, there was no team around me to help me, no team around me to advise me. You know, I didn't have any support anywhere. It was just more or less me doing it on my own. Um, which, you know, um, obviously didn't work out very well. And then it was after that fight when I realized that it was just, I'm training myself that I'm not getting any support from any of my team. I thought I need to make some big changes.

Andy Smith 31:19 
And are you, you know, the minute you turn pro, does that mean the money goes up or is, you know, do you start off?

Luke Campbell MBE 31:26 
Depends on your contract. But for me, yeah, it was now time for, I was just getting, as an amateur, it was just like, after fight, after fight, oh, you win this fight, that's it, you made, you were made for life. It was always that and it never really came. But yeah, I just thought, now I'm in the professional game, I fight for money, now it's time to make as much money as possible for my family and then get out the spot. I didn't want to be in that spot for too long, I didn't want to come out of their punch drunk or my brain's mashed, you know, I still wanted my health when I come out of there.

Andy Smith 32:00 
People don't realize that a lot of this is self-funded, so you see you going in the amateur ranks, getting the gold medal, all that sort of thing. You're being paid, but it's not enough. I think you said you were living with 30 pounds of your name to spend on yourself at the end of the month. Affording a massage therapist, affording some tech, affording recovery, all that sort of thing it's another barrier.

Luke Campbell MBE 32:27 
A lot of things have to be cut short in camps, you know, because camps can go crazy on spending. So there's a lot of things that have to get cut short, you know, whether it's a physio or recovery session or whatever else, it's cutting back on that because all the costs are on me. So it's, you know, when, when money's tight and you ain't got a lot, it's, you know, you need to start, you know, picking one when you can and the food you get and everything to go with it because comp camps can get really expensive. Spiring partners, you got to pay for them travel hotels, everything.

Andy Smith 33:11 
Yeah. So then your, you know, your, your pro ranks increasing, your, your opponents are getting, you know, bigger, more formidable, heavier hitting. Um, you know, is, is the support there at the top in terms of like, you know, your teams, say, for example, one of, you know, one of your biggest fights, Lomachenko, um, what does the lead up to that look like? You know, is it just train, train, train, train, train, you know, um, or are you trying to take some time for yourself? How does that look?

Luke Campbell MBE 33:44 
No, I mean, it was when you're fighting the number one pound for pound on the planet, it was train, train, train, train, train, you know, um, and probably the only time I had a team around me, um, was only in like the last two to three years of my career was when I was with Shane McGuigan. I say only time I felt I had a proper team around me, um, and a team that cared and a team that sort of ticked every box and it was a journey together. The whole rest of my career in the professional rankings, I more or less did it on my own. I didn't have any proper team around me. So I would say for any boxer that's going, going into professional boxing, please make sure that you've got a team or a proper team around you that are on that journey with you and care for you. Um, because I did, I did 80% of my career on my own by myself. So I didn't do too bad.

Andy Smith 34:40 
Yeah, exactly. And you know, you got when you get to the point where you got promotion and that sort of thing, you know, you've set up all the big fights, you know, you get to the pinnacle of your career or not the pinnacle, the end of your career almost. Garcia is your last fight. And I watched that fight. I mean, it was incredible. It was one of the best fights you can watch because of the drama that unfolded throughout the whole thing. And you know, you went in as a serious undercard or not an undercard, an underdog.

Luke Campbell MBE 35:12 
Underdog, yeah.

Andy Smith 35:13 
I don't know why. You don't know why. I think, you know, I can, and I think the whole of the UK rule back in you. And first one to put him, you know, see the canvas.

Luke Campbell MBE 35:25 
Yeah. Do you know what? I set that shot up. I literally set it up and then I was put to sleep and I was stood in the corner and I was watching him and I have never seen anyone recover as quick as that in my entire life in boxing. Never. I've had kids with half a shot where the legs are scrambled for a couple of rounds if I hadn't finished them already and I was took back and I thought that's not normal. That's not normal. People say to me, oh, when you went out there, why don't you go in for the finish? Trust me, I did, but he was fully recovered. He was fully recovered from getting put to sleep within the count of eight, like fully there again and fully recovered. That's just not normal and I ain't never seen that before. And then it explains his drug test disappeared at the end of the fight. So it's like, you know what?

Andy Smith 36:24 
Linking the two together, I mean.

Luke Campbell MBE 36:27 
I don't want to say anything that I shouldn't, but you know, put two and two together.

Andy Smith 36:33 
Yeah. And you know, you see the fashion, the way he goes down, you see, you know, for me, I'm jumping up screaming at the TV by then, you know, I think most of the UK is, you know, everything he's done, he's done it, you know, there's no way he's recovering from this. And like you say, bounce back up again.

Luke Campbell MBE 36:48 
Yeah. And then on that, the judge has only scored me a 10-9 round. How? Why?

Andy Smith 36:56 
No, exactly. And it just seems full of beans afterwards. I mean, there seems obviously drugs have always been a problem in the boxing industry. And we're seeing, you know, we're seeing boxers now getting banned and coming back out of it. And, you know, for me, we're starting to see this biohacking tech a lot more in elite sports. Because people are starting to understand the benefits that come from them. You know, if you can oxygenate the body, if you can recharge the body, if you can do all these things, but uses the body's natural ability to do it, you know, then they don't have to take drugs and cheat in these ways.

Luke Campbell MBE 37:37 
I just think like boxing's a dangerous sport as it is, if you're cheating and taking supplements that are banned to enhance performance, you should be banned forever from boxing. No, I agree. It should be a total banning. You should be looking at a prison sentence. People die in boxing, you know, you get an handful of people every year that die in the ring. Um, so I think if someone wants to cheat, I think they should look, not only get banned from boxing, but look at having a jail sentence.

Andy Smith 38:07 
Yeah.

Luke Campbell MBE 38:07 
Because it's wrong.

Andy Smith 38:08 
You see in, you know, Olympic weightlifting and that sort of thing, the difference between those that are taking steroids and the ones that aren't, you know, there's a very, very big difference between those two people. You put that into a boxing environment where, you know, people can get seriously hurt, you know, it's a bad combination. Do you think there's enough testing? Or is it that...

Luke Campbell MBE 38:31 
The thing with testing is it's expensive. I got tested my whole career from coming out of the Olympics, but I was getting tested my whole career. I had to give Vada my address where I was going to be every single night because they could turn up randomly at my doorstep. And I'm on this, and then I look around and there's three world champions that are on it. I'm not even a world titles at this point. Why are these on it? You know, why is it just me that's on it? You're just a handful of people that's on it and the rest of them are. So I just, it rather should be everyone's on that testing or nobody. So I just, I just don't. Yeah, but there isn't enough testing because it is a dangerous sport.

Andy Smith 39:22 
Yeah, yeah. And you know, the good thing is we're seeing this shift over to people trying to do these different things to their bodies naturally, you know, and we've, we've, the Premier League seems to have really caught up now with, with this sort of technology, especially PMF and red light there, you know, we've recently sold to Newcastle Football Club and City. We sold a device to Cristiano Ronaldo, you know, personally and all these things. So they're starting to, you know, this, this way of looking at recovery differently, you know, the, especially like Ronaldo, you know, he's getting old, you know, we all get old, we're going to take longer to recover. We're not going to be able to be running around chasing those young guys anymore.

Luke Campbell MBE 40:07 
We all get old none of us want to get old. So we try and do as much as we can recovery sad to keep us young.

Andy Smith 40:13 
Exactly. And the strength doesn't necessarily drop off. That's the thing, you know, we can, you can get 50 year olds just as strong as 20 year olds, but it's about how long it takes to recover after you've done that exercise. And that's, you know, that's where this tech is really useful.

Luke Campbell MBE 40:26 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 40:27 
Boxing for you, you know, there's no YouTube debut coming back from retirement because, you know, one of these guys are going to call you out. That's not on the cards.

Luke Campbell MBE 40:36 
Well I would love a YouTube fight, if there's any YouTubers out there that want to test the self against an Olympic gold medalist. Jake Paul, unfortunately, he got stopped by Anthony Joshua, who was also an Olympic gold medalist. If he wants to try again with someone who was a little bit lighter, say me, the doors open for a discussion.

Andy Smith 41:05 
No, why wouldn't you?

Luke Campbell MBE 41:06 
Yeah, exactly.

Andy Smith 41:07 
So, you know, boxing...

Luke Campbell MBE 41:09 
You've got to take your hat off to him for going in the ring with Joshua.

Andy Smith 41:13 
I mean, to be fair, when that got announced, I thought, never going to happen. It probably won't even allow that to happen, but Facty got in there and did it. I mean, it takes balls of steel to...

Luke Campbell MBE 41:28 
Yeah, I was going to say. I think that must be swollen was his nuts because you've got to have a big pair to get in there with Joshua.

Andy Smith 41:35 
Yeah, a hundred percent, so, you know, and I don't know if Joshua is in full gear during that. I think he probably might have, you know, finished it a bit quicker. Maybe they want to make a bit of a spectacle.

Luke Campbell MBE 41:47 
Do you know what I think he was in full gear because it's always that risk element of if this goes wrong, you are absolutely finished and your whole career is in the pan and your reputation and everything. So I think he must have really been on it just to think that he can't afford to make a mistake, you know, because the slightest little knock on the temple or top of the head or his legs are gone or whatever, it's no good.

Andy Smith 42:16 
Yeah, so you know you're keen on ice bath sauna. We're in your house at the moment. We're sitting in front of an arm sitting in front of your sauna. You've got an ice bath in the corner. You've got the PEMF and red light. Do you wish you had this tech back when you were at the top of your game? Do you think it would have made a difference to you?

Luke Campbell MBE 42:35 
Yeah, most definitely. Recovery was always one of the things that I felt held me back a little bit. I couldn't recover enough. I had one of them bodies that was quite finely tuned. What was different to other boxes is they could just keep flogging the self every day. I couldn't do that. I couldn't flog myself. I needed to pull back a little bit or have a little bit of extra rest in between. Just built differently. But I definitely feel like if I've had these sort of tools now during the career and used them, my recovery would have been much better.

Andy Smith 43:14 
Yeah, and what you're finding, you know, you're sitting in front of the CELLER8 PEMF and Redlight device, what you find in your key benefits from using that each time.

Luke Campbell MBE 43:24 
For me, obviously I'm still training, so recovery is still there, aching muscles, I'll jump on that, which I do feel that benefit. But for me now, it's more on the sides of the mental recovery. I feel like that really helps zone me out and recover mentally.

Andy Smith 43:45 
And that kind of leads on to, you know, your new role. So, you know, first of all, how does that come about? You know, you're an X-Pro boxer. All of a sudden you're the mayor of Hull and East Yorkshire. So what, you know.

Luke Campbell MBE 43:59 
The answer to that is I don't know. It literally just all happened within the space of two weeks out of nowhere. I had no intentions of running. I didn't know anything about the role. And it just all spun on its head within a couple of weeks. And then all of a sudden I'm campaigning to be the mayor. And I had one little bit of motivation. And the thought was that this whole region really supported me during my career. And I just thought, well, what if I could give something back to everyone that supported me in my career and made a difference to this place, put the people first for once and started making decisions with every, with the people of this region and not just for them. And I had that little bit of inspiration to thought, you know what? I want to give back to my community. That's the only thing what then just made me step up and say, all right, I'll do it.

Andy Smith 44:50 
Yeah. And I think, you know, you had the public vote, you know, because you can see, you know, you're a very genuine guy. You can see that through your career. You've kind of done all these different feats and you've kind of been very honest throughout it. And, you know, you didn't take these through all these different things. And, you know, from your dancing and ice days, you know, the, you know, the public's there back in you and they want to see you do well. So the NHS, let's talk about the NHS. We bring it up on this podcast every now and then. And, you know, it's got pros and cons and even myself, you know, I've got my own health story. And when I needed the NHS, they cut me open, they got, they, they fixed me. Yeah. It was the, it was the aftercare after then and, you know, the medication and the antibiotics that kind of, it wasn't, it wasn't the best, you know, situation. And I think, like you said before, people see it as a, you know, as a aftercare, as a healthcare system. And it's not really, it's like an intervention more than anything. But, you know, from your opinion, do you think the NHS is broken?

Luke Campbell MBE 46:00 
I think the NHS is broken. My mum was in there a couple of weeks ago. She had really bad stomach aches and she was sat in A&E for 10 hours. But she said she was heartbroken. And she said she could have cried just through looking at some of the old grandmas and old granddads that are in there on beds for like 15, 16 hours of waiting. And she said it was really upset her to see her. You know, my mum's getting on as well. But it was, yeah, I just think it is broken. But I also look at hospitals a lot differently. I would never trust it with my health. But if I was to go in there and I had my appendix, my appendix was swelling up. One, they'd take my appendix out and fix it. If I broke my leg, they'd fix it. You know, if I cut myself, I needed stitches to look after me.

Andy Smith 46:56 
Yeah.

Luke Campbell MBE 46:56 
But the more I always look at it, it's a fixer. It's not, I shouldn't depend on the hospital to look after my health.

Andy Smith 47:03 
Yeah. And I think that's a good way to look at it. And I think that's the way the UK has to look at it. You know, it's not, it's not just a free healthcare system in terms of how do I lose weight, let's go, the NHS.

Luke Campbell MBE 47:13 
Nothing's free. Someone's paying for it.

Andy Smith 47:16 
Yeah. And you know, you've got to put your own hard work in sometimes.

Luke Campbell MBE 47:19 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 47:20 
You know, it doesn't come down to all situations, but you know, do you think the NHS needs reform?

Luke Campbell MBE 47:27 
Most definitely, yeah. I think there's a lot of changes that needs to be made in the NHS. I'm sat now when I sit with the chair of the ICB board who helps, who sits on the NHS across three regions. So yeah, I'm getting to know a lot more about the NHS and how it works and how it runs, which is interesting. Because obviously, for me as mayor, my portfolio is fit and healthy. So I want to bring everything back to the communities. The community centre is what we had as kids where we used to go play a bit of pool, some darts, there was a tuck shop. Like that worked. That was fantastic. It gave kids somewhere to go on an evening. But we can do more than that. So all the ones that have been decommissioned and closed down, I want to, for this region, I really want to get back in to open up the community centres, get the sport aspect in there. So get kids fit, get them moving, but also adding education as well. Like where you've got your retired bricklayer that might voluntarily come along and help teach the kids how to build a brick wall, like education, that's sad as well. So it's like, we all know it used to work, and they're not about as many nowadays. So I want to bring them back to life, but then add on to what we know what worked.

Andy Smith 48:44 
And you know, the points you mentioned about the NHS being broken, like, what do you think can be done to fix it? Is there a simple answer to that?

Luke Campbell MBE 48:54 
I don't think there is, I don't think there is a simple answer to that. Um, I always look at, like I say, it's good for some stuff and maybe not so good for other stuff. Um, but I always look at it as that, you know, you've got an all you can eat restaurant. You know, that's cheap food, but you can get as much quantity as you can have. Or you can go and have a really nice meal somewhere. It's a quality meal, but you've got to pay more money for it. I always look at that as that's the NHS and, you know, this is private.

Andy Smith 49:27 
And can we reduced waiting times, you know, that you mentioned that earlier about like people sitting in waiting rooms for 16 hours and something. Is there a quick fix? Do we need more hospitals or do we, you know.

Luke Campbell MBE 49:37 
Well I think we need to bring it more back into community-based. I think the heart of the communities, I think everything stands in the heart of communities. So I think we can bring certain things back to our communities that will take pressure off the hospitals.

Andy Smith 49:53 
And you got quite a lot involved with Nigel Farage and obviously he was spearheading the whole Brexit, being a business owner, you're a business owner, you know, my view on Brexit was that it's probably the worst thing that's happened to the UK. I don't know if you agree, but is there any chance of us coming back in? You know, is this back into Europe?

Luke Campbell MBE 50:13 
Um, I have, so I have no idea on that. Um, I look at, I mean, there's a lot of people that say Brexit was really bad for this country, but then, you know, and our economy is down because of it, but then if you look at Germany and France, who were still in it, their economy is more broken than ours and they're in it. Um, so there's arguments on both sides. Um, as far as I was aware, I thought Boris Johnson did that deal, um, because he was prime minister, so I thought he would, he did that deal. But other than that, I'm not too sure. I stepped up to be mayor, to look after, to be a part of the community in this region, you know, so under my remit, we have skills, transport, health, housing and investment, so I've, I've got to focus on them. And normally when I get national politics come at me, I should go and ask the MPs. That's their job. Yeah. No, it gets. They get paid to be an MP, go and ask them, you know, so that's, that's where I lie with it all.

Andy Smith 51:17 
Yeah, we spoke about the NHS, you know, and needing reform, but what kind of power do you have as mayor to make changes?

Luke Campbell MBE 51:27 
Very limited at the moment. I know with devolution, more powers are coming down to the mayors, but all the decisions are made in government with what happens with the NHS. So it's all on them, and obviously, they've made a lot of movement. I mean, I think after the workforce are getting laid off in the NHS, and they say that the speeding waiting time's up, but I haven't seen none of that yet. Like I say, it's all on the government. I don't have any control. I wish I did have control in this region of how we can change things, but unfortunately, I don't.

Andy Smith 52:05 
One thing you do have control of, and we spoke about this earlier, was that you're looking at taking health into your own hands in the local community. And one way you want to do that is open your own longevity center, which is incredible. You know, we're just seeing these popping up around the UK now. And it's great because, you know, we're encouraging people to take health back into their own hands now and no better way than doing that in one of these preventative centers. So, you know, what's your plans for that and when can we see this opening?

Luke Campbell MBE 52:35 
Well, that's exactly it. It's giving people the choice for them to be at their optimal self and giving them access to a facility that can help do that, you know, without technology and the longevity tools that are out there now, people can be feeling great and being at the best selves there can be. And I just, I want to be able to provide such a service that can help people do that.

Andy Smith 53:00 
And what modalities are you looking to put into there? So we spoke about saunas, ice baths, but you even mentioned IVs.

Luke Campbell MBE 53:07 
Yeah, IVs, ozone therapy, tailor-made vitamins that matches their bloodworks, all blood tests, basically top-to-toe health checks, MOTs, red light, everything, auction chambers. So yeah, I just want to provide a facility that can give people screening and top-to-toe health checks and tests.

Andy Smith 53:39 
Yeah. And I like the way that this is going these days because, you know, people will spend thousands, thousands on supplements. I did for years, you know, taking all these different supplements, but you don't really know what you're taking them for. And I'm taking vitamin D every day, but I don't know if I've got a vitamin D deficiency. You know, I'm, I'm just taking it because so-and-so told me to take it.

Luke Campbell MBE 53:56 
Yeah.

Andy Smith 53:57 
So, you know, looking at things on, on the blood work now on a cellular level is, it's, you know, really helping people and seeing these centers opening up is, is pretty incredible. So, you know, and people like yourself now with your background, with, you know, the mayor now and back in this type of healthcare, you know, it's, it's, it's really good to see. When, when do you think that can be open?

Luke Campbell MBE 54:18 
I think we're looking it up in the next couple of months. So yeah, that's quite exciting to be able to be a part of this journey where, you know, we can, we can then provide a facility where people can be at the best, you know, and they can get, they ain't got to go to America or Turkey or something like that to get health checks that, you know, they can get it here at a reasonable price and a top quality service.

Andy Smith 54:45 
Good. Where can people find you if, you know, maybe if they're not going to connect to you directly, but if they live in Holland, East Yorkshire and they want to make a change, you know, or they want to find your boxing gyms or they want to, you know, know more about the opening of the Longevity Centre, what's the best way to kind of search for your contact, contact you or your team?

Luke Campbell MBE 55:04 
I think my social media, Luke, 1-1 Campbell, that's always a good one to reach out to. Or they can email me at mayor@hullandeastyorkshire.co.gov and get in touch.

Andy Smith 55:21 
Do you have one of those gold chains?

Luke Campbell MBE 55:23 
No, everybody asked me that.

Andy Smith 55:25 
Because our mayor, you know, down in Kent.

Luke Campbell MBE 55:27 
But that's the Lord Mayor.

Andy Smith 55:29 
Oh, okay.

Luke Campbell MBE 55:29 
So I'm a Metro Mayor. So there's 14 Metro Mayors in the country.

Andy Smith 55:33 
Oh, I see. This is all news to me.

Luke Campbell MBE 55:36 
So yeah, Metro Mayors are completely different to Lord Mayors. People ask me all the time, where's your chain and gowns? I went, you know, I wish I was a Lord Mayor. It'd be much easier.

Andy Smith 55:46 
You've got a much better goal chain than anybody else.

Luke Campbell MBE 55:50 
Yeah, I am pretty gutted though, I didn't get that change.

Andy Smith 55:53 
Yeah, so for our listeners, thanks again for listening to another episode of the PEMF podcast, whatever streaming platform you're listening on, leave us 5 star review, it helps us get more amazing guests like Luke Campbell and professional athletes on this event, on this show, should I say. Thanks again for joining us, Luke.

Luke Campbell MBE 56:08 
Brilliant. Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure.