Andy Smith 00:00 
A quick disclaimer before we begin, the PEMF podcast does not contain any medical advice, and the content provided is for informational purposes only. If you have any health concerns, please visit a healthcare professional. Welcome back to the PEMF podcast. Today we're going to be talking about PEMF and mental health, specifically depression, and how PEMF therapy can play a powerful role in supporting emotional and neurological balance. We'll explore what's really going on the brain during depression, and how PEMF therapy can work on a cellular level, a neurological level, and why people are turning to it as a natural and non-invasive support tool. We'll also reference studies along the way.

Joshua Roberts 00:41 
I think a good place to start with this would be to see what's the difference between depression and other mental health conditions.

Andy Smith 00:47 
Depression is a mood disorder that impacts how a person feels, thinks and functions day to day. It's more than just occasional sadness. It involves a persistent, often overwhelming low mood that can last for weeks or even months. Depression is characterized by a low mood, loss of interest or pleasure, and persistent feelings of sadness, hopelessness or emptiness. People often describe feeling emotionally numb or heavy, and they can also experience fatigue, sleep or appetite changes and difficulty concentrating. While other health conditions like anxiety, may imbibe high alertness or fear-driven responses, depression typically presents as a kind of emotional and physical shutdown. It's more about disconnection and withdrawal than over-reactor, sorry, over-activation. Understanding these distinctions can help clarify why depression often needs a different treatment approach than other mental challenges.

Joshua Roberts 01:47 
What are some traditional treatments for depression and why is it that they work for some but not for everyone?

Andy Smith 01:53 
Traditional treatments for depression usually include anti-depressant medications, more commonly SSRIs and SNRIs, which aim to balance brain chemicals like serotonin and norepinephrine. Another major treatment option is talk therapy, especially cognitive behaviour therapy, also known as CBT, which helps people reframe negative thought patterns. There are also lifestyle-based approaches like exercise, mindfulness and nutrition that have proven benefits. But here's the key, not everyone responds the same way to these treatments. Some medications can be life-changing for others, they might just cause side effects or have little relief, basically. Similarly, talk therapy works well for many, but others struggle to make progress, especially if the root causes are more biological or neurological. That's where there's growing interest in therapies like PEMF. These support more like the brain, the body, on a cellular level, offering a new angle of support, especially for those who haven't found relief through the conventional methods.

Joshua Roberts 02:58 
therapies like PEMF have definitely gained interest for anxiety and depression. We've noticed that the studies we share, uh, about both on our Instagram always seem to get a lot of traction and attention. Uh, if you'd like to see these studies and explore more content around PEMF health, wellness, complimentary therapies, make sure to check us out on Instagram. We're literally at the PEMF podcast, uh, and yeah, loads of stuff on there. Make sure to drop us a follow, but for someone who may not have heard of PEMF or can you just explain it just in 30 seconds really quickly?

Andy Smith 03:31 
Yes, if anyone hasn't listened before, if you just need a refresher, PEMF therapy stands for post-electromagnetic field therapy. It's all about applying magnetic fields to the body at different pulse rates. And in doing that, you'll create an environment to heal or regulate the body or the mind.

Joshua Roberts 03:48 
Since anti-depressants like SSRIs and SNRIs are the standard first-line treatment for depression and widely prescribed, especially in moderate to severe cases, has there been any research on using PEMF alongside those medications as a complementary therapy to boost treatment outcomes?

Andy Smith 04:07 
Yes there are, there's a randomised double blind controlled trial that found PEMF therapy significantly improved outcomes in patients with major depression, particularly those who were already on antidepressant medication but not responding well. So over a 5 week period patients received 30 minutes of daily PEMF sessions on weekdays. Those in the active PEMF group showed much greater improvements than those in the sham group. Starting from week 1 and continuing throughout the study, by the end the response rates were 61% versus 12.9% and remission rates were 33.9% versus just 4.1% in favour of the active PEMF group. This suggests that PEMF can safely and effectively augment antidepressant medication, especially in treatment resistant cases.

Joshua Roberts 05:00 
So if PEMF is showing promise for people with treatment resistant depression, what do we actually know about how it works? What's happening in the brain that makes this therapy effective?

Andy Smith 05:10 
That's a great question, and while we're still learning, research like this review in 2016 has pulled together some really compelling insights. They also looked at how low-strength transcranial PEMF, or TPEMF, which is applying PEMF to the head, might influence the brain in people with depression. What they found is that PEMF seems to act on several major systems at once, so for one, it may boost brain metabolism, helping neurons produce and use energy more effectively. It also seemed to enhance neurological connectivity, which is crucial because depression is also linked to poor communication between key brain regions, like the prefrontal cortex and the limbic system. The study also pointed to effects on neuroplasticity, which is the brain's ability to adapt and rewire itself, a function often impaired in chronic depression. And interestingly, they noted potential links to immune regulation and even the body's biological clock, both of which are increasingly understood to play a role in mood disorders. So while PEMF doesn't target just one chemical like many antidepressants do, it may work on restoring balance across multiple systems, and that could be why it's showing promise for people who haven't responded to traditional treatments.

Joshua Roberts 06:27 
Is there any other kind of notable studies or registrations that PEMF has for depression?

Andy Smith 06:34 
So yeah for sure we should mention that the FDA cleared pulse electromagnetic field therapy for the treatment of depression in 2006. So specifically PEMF therapy devices were approved in that year for both marketing with indications covering both depression and anxiety. So the FDA recognized PEMF therapy as a treatment for those conditions.

Joshua Roberts 06:55 
Okay, so we know PEMF doesn't treat the symptoms directly, but one of the most debilitating symptoms of depression is anhedonia, which is the loss of interest or pleasure in life that we talked about earlier on. I saw a study that used brain scans to look at how TPEMF might impact the brain's reward system. Can you explain what they found and how it might be relatable to helping people with the lack of joy and motivation people often experience in depression? Can you explain what they found and how it might be relatable to people with the Can you explain what they found and how it might be relatable to people with the lack of joy and motivation people often experience in depression?

Andy Smith 07:25 
Yeah absolutely, anodynia is a major part of depression and it's one of the hardest symptoms to treat. The study you're referencing used fMRI brain scans to see how transcranial PEMF affects the brain's reward pathways specifically, how we process the outcomes that are supposed to feel good or rewarding. After five weeks of daily transcranial PEMF, the researchers found that people in the active group showed reduced activation in certain areas of the brain linked to reward like the left inferior frontal gyrus. At first that might sound negative but what it actually suggests is a normalization of the reward circuitry. In depression this system is often overactive in a dysfunctional way or completely blunted. So while they didn't see a big clinical change in mood, in this short study they did show how TPEMF is doing something meaningful in the brain, especially in areas tied to pleasure, motivation and the emotional engagement side of it. That's a promise in Simon it comes to targeting anodynia which standard medications often struggle to fully address.

Joshua Roberts 08:35 
That's the thing with PEMF, sometimes you may not feel straight away what is happening or what it's doing to your body but it's having some amazing effects in the background. But are there any particular types of depression like seasonal, chronic or postpartum depression that PEMF might help more with or be less effective for?

Andy Smith 08:53 
Yes, a great question. Right now, most of the research on PEMF for depression has focused on major depressive disorder, especially treatment resistant depression cases where people haven't responded well to medications. That's where PEMF seems to show the most promise, particularly in like as an adjunct therapy alongside antidepressants. There's some early evidence that PEMF might also be helpful for seasonal depression. Since light and electromagnetic fields, both interact with the body circadian rhythms, which is our internal biological clock for those to understand. The connection is especially interesting because circadian disruption is a known factor in seasonal affective disorder. As postpartum depression, there isn't much published yet. But it's a growing area of interest because PEMF is a non-invasive and doesn't involve pharmaceuticals. It might eventually become an appealing option, especially for those wanting to avoid medication during or after pregnancy. But in this area, obviously, there's a lot more studies that are definitely needed before we can draw strong conclusions there. Ensure PEMF seems to be the most studied and effective by far for chronic treatment, resistant depression. But there's a lot of potential for other subtypes and we will know more as the research expands.

Joshua Roberts 10:16 
What is a common way to apply PEMF for depression? When it comes to physical conditions, we normally recommend a full body mat. Is that still the case here?

Andy Smith 10:24 
Yeah, for depression PEMF can be applied in a few different ways, you can go for the traditional full body mat which is often a good option because it helps support overall systemic balance including circulation and nervous system regulation. However, for targeted brain support, transcranial PEMF or TPEMF devices are often used to directly influence brain activity. Many devices can be strapped on or around or near the head and some people use a combination of both, starting with full body sessions and adding a focused treatment over time.

Joshua Roberts 10:58 
Aside from that, what should someone really look for in a device? Are there any specific intensities that are more effective?

Andy Smith 11:03 
Yeah, when choosing a PEMF device of depression, look for one that supports low to moderate intensity settings, in my opinion, typically in the range of one to a hundred gauss. Most of the studies and depression have been used in low strength transcranial PEMF. So it's more of a gentle consistent stimulation, which appears to be more effective. Uh, but that's not to say that high intensity wouldn't be also a good option. Uh, we've got an example in terms of proactive Manchester guys. They use a high intensity device and often share really amazing stories, uh, recently with someone with depression who turned the life around in a few sessions, but you need to be careful applying high intensity to the head.

Joshua Roberts 11:43 
Talking about frequency, what frequencies should people be using or are there any specific protocols they should know about?

Andy Smith 11:50 
Frequencies in the alpha range, then that's 8 to 12 hertz, or the theta range, 4 to 8 hertz, are commonly associated with relaxation and calm brainwave states. So these may benefit the most with depression. Some protocols often use delta frequencies, which is one to four hertz, to support deep restorative processes. While there's no one size fits all or protocol, starting daily sessions using calming frequencies and adjusting based on how the person feels over time is, it would be my best recommendation.

Joshua Roberts 12:20 
Do we know how long someone should use PEMF for depression? Are we talking weeks, months, or is it something people would use long-term, like medications? And how often, every day, once a week, once a month?

Andy Smith 12:32 
Most studies showing benefits have used daily sessions for four to six weeks, especially in clinical or treatment resistant cases. Many people begin to notice changes within about a couple of weeks, but longer use often brings deeper, more lasting improvements. Some continue to use PEMF long-term, similar to how medication or therapy is used. A typical starting point might be once or twice daily for like 20 to 30 minutes, and then you can taper that as and when you need.

Joshua Roberts 13:01 
For someone who listens to this right now, who feels like they've tried everything but still feel stuck, what would you say to them about trying something like PEMF?

Andy Smith 13:10 
Yeah, if you're feeling stuck, often after trying medications, normal therapy or lifestyle changes, you're not alone. Depression can be incredibly complex and healing often isn't very linear. PEMF isn't a cure-all but offers a different pathway, one that works on the body and brain at a foundational level, supporting the system that standard treatments may miss. It's a non-invasive, gentle and well tolerated and many people find it helps when nothing else has. If you're open to trying something new, PEMF therapy could be a valuable tool in a journey and completely complimentary to everything you're already trying.

Joshua Roberts 13:46 
For sure. And all of the studies that we have mentioned today will be linked below this episode if you want to go and have a little deep dive as well. If you want to have a little bit of a deep dive, as I say, go check out our Instagram, loads more stuff on there. Also linked below or just Google us or search us at the PEMF podcast. But while you're down there, make sure to leave us any questions that you got from this episode and we'll make sure that you answer them as well as subscribe and please leave us a five star rating on your favorite streaming platform. It helps us get more amazing guests in the future and helps us make more bigger and better episodes for you.